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	<title>Comments on: Are scientists missing the boat&#8230;.</title>
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	<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/</link>
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	<pubDate>Tue,  6 Jan 2009 02:27:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: David Crotty</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16733</link>
		<dc:creator>David Crotty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 21:07:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16733</guid>
		<description>Lin, I guess  I'm just not convinced that the internet and Web 2.0 is the complete answer for everything in the world of science.  I think there are some interesting directions, and that likely in the future we'll find some very valuable uses.  But I have yet to see reason why someone would want to invest the time, money and effort needed to switch over their current operations, which work reasonably well, to an untested new system that doesn't offer anything overwhelmingly compelling.  If someone builds a system as you suggest, I'm sure scientists will evaluate it and decide if it's worth their time and effort.  I think one of the big stumbling blocks is that the bulk of science, the really important stuff, is the research, not the communication and interaction, and too many of these new ventures place the latter before the former.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lin, I guess  I&#8217;m just not convinced that the internet and Web 2.0 is the complete answer for everything in the world of science.  I think there are some interesting directions, and that likely in the future we&#8217;ll find some very valuable uses.  But I have yet to see reason why someone would want to invest the time, money and effort needed to switch over their current operations, which work reasonably well, to an untested new system that doesn&#8217;t offer anything overwhelmingly compelling.  If someone builds a system as you suggest, I&#8217;m sure scientists will evaluate it and decide if it&#8217;s worth their time and effort.  I think one of the big stumbling blocks is that the bulk of science, the really important stuff, is the research, not the communication and interaction, and too many of these new ventures place the latter before the former.</p>
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		<title>By: Lin</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16730</link>
		<dc:creator>Lin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 12:45:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16730</guid>
		<description>I think maybe blogs, Wiki and scattered sites are not good enough and what we need is an Unified Internet Science Platform on which scientists can do all there work, include recording scientific data, making collaboration, doing peer-review, publishing papers, etc. A platform which can put research, publishing and evaluation together so that scientists can do all their work on it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think maybe blogs, Wiki and scattered sites are not good enough and what we need is an Unified Internet Science Platform on which scientists can do all there work, include recording scientific data, making collaboration, doing peer-review, publishing papers, etc. A platform which can put research, publishing and evaluation together so that scientists can do all their work on it.</p>
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		<title>By: Jan</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16728</link>
		<dc:creator>Jan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 02:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16728</guid>
		<description>Hi all, thanks for this discussion! I'm one of the co-founders of Mendeley I would just like to comment on Brian's post further above to get the image about Mendeley right :)

Mendeley is initially two things: Mendeley Desktop is free academic software for managing and sharing research papers. Mendeley Web is a free research network which lets you access your papers online, discover research trends and connect to like-minded researchers.

Mendeley Desktop is already a useful tool without any sharing functionalities (but with automatic metadata extraction). It's free, and it can in many ways already replace existing, and very expensive PDF and citation management tools which are out there. If that leaves a bad taste in anyone's mouth, I trust it's because we do something better.

On top of that there's Mendeley Web: here we are aggregating metadata (and this doesn't have anything to do with the acutaly content of a paper) based on our users and display statistics about up-and-coming papers, most important authors and articles, or most read publications. We call this "A Last.fm for Research" - based on your reading behaviour Mendeley will aim to recommend you papers and introduce you to like-minded people based on your digital library and reading behaviour (once there's enough data).

But just start with PDF and citation management, desktop- and web-based... we hope Mendeley can already take away some of the major problems researchers encounter.

Thanks
Jan</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi all, thanks for this discussion! I&#8217;m one of the co-founders of Mendeley I would just like to comment on Brian&#8217;s post further above to get the image about Mendeley right <img src='http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Mendeley is initially two things: Mendeley Desktop is free academic software for managing and sharing research papers. Mendeley Web is a free research network which lets you access your papers online, discover research trends and connect to like-minded researchers.</p>
<p>Mendeley Desktop is already a useful tool without any sharing functionalities (but with automatic metadata extraction). It&#8217;s free, and it can in many ways already replace existing, and very expensive PDF and citation management tools which are out there. If that leaves a bad taste in anyone&#8217;s mouth, I trust it&#8217;s because we do something better.</p>
<p>On top of that there&#8217;s Mendeley Web: here we are aggregating metadata (and this doesn&#8217;t have anything to do with the acutaly content of a paper) based on our users and display statistics about up-and-coming papers, most important authors and articles, or most read publications. We call this &#8220;A Last.fm for Research&#8221; - based on your reading behaviour Mendeley will aim to recommend you papers and introduce you to like-minded people based on your digital library and reading behaviour (once there&#8217;s enough data).</p>
<p>But just start with PDF and citation management, desktop- and web-based&#8230; we hope Mendeley can already take away some of the major problems researchers encounter.</p>
<p>Thanks<br />
Jan</p>
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		<title>By: David Crotty</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16726</link>
		<dc:creator>David Crotty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 15:33:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16726</guid>
		<description>Hi Lin, sorry I took so long to answer your comment, I've been traveling.  I think each of the sites listed has some value, but it's really going to be up to the individual to decide if it's useful for them.  The problem with sites of this ilk is that they require a decent sized community before they're really useful, and that's been the downfall of many of the science web 2.0 approaches.  Kind of a catch-22, it's not useful until lots of folks have joined, but no one will join if it's not useful.  Clearly the two standouts in your list are PLoS ONE, which has developed a new niche in science publishing and shown it can turn a profit, and Arxiv.org, which has had a profound impact on some areas of science.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Lin, sorry I took so long to answer your comment, I&#8217;ve been traveling.  I think each of the sites listed has some value, but it&#8217;s really going to be up to the individual to decide if it&#8217;s useful for them.  The problem with sites of this ilk is that they require a decent sized community before they&#8217;re really useful, and that&#8217;s been the downfall of many of the science web 2.0 approaches.  Kind of a catch-22, it&#8217;s not useful until lots of folks have joined, but no one will join if it&#8217;s not useful.  Clearly the two standouts in your list are PLoS ONE, which has developed a new niche in science publishing and shown it can turn a profit, and Arxiv.org, which has had a profound impact on some areas of science.</p>
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		<title>By: Lin</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16724</link>
		<dc:creator>Lin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 06:11:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16724</guid>
		<description>Hello David,
I like your articles. You can always help me to find the main problems. 
Could you tell me your opinion about these sites? I think the are excelent.
www.labroots.com
www.plosone.org   (PLoS ONE)
www.scienceblog.com
openwetware.org
arxiv.org
Aren't they worth useing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello David,<br />
I like your articles. You can always help me to find the main problems.<br />
Could you tell me your opinion about these sites? I think the are excelent.<br />
<a href="http://www.labroots.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.labroots.com</a><br />
<a href="http://www.plosone.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.plosone.org</a>   (PLoS ONE)<br />
<a href="http://www.scienceblog.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.scienceblog.com</a><br />
openwetware.org<br />
arxiv.org<br />
Aren&#8217;t they worth useing?</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Krueger</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16721</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Krueger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 19:35:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16721</guid>
		<description>Hey David, I just came across your blog during my weekly, "Who has linked to LabSpaces" google search.  Looks like you posted this almost a month ago, so I'm not sure how I missed it, but thanks for the link and the quote.

Pete is 100% right.  Obtaining the initial community is the hardest part and I don't think any of the services out there have gotten to that point.  There are three types of science networks out there: The linkedin clones, the research sharers, and the publication sharers.  My site falls somewhere among all three.  

Now, the linkedin clones are useless, so don't even try visiting BioMedExperts, academia.edu, scilink, etc.  

The research sharing sites have a decent idea, but as my boss would argue e-mail is just as good, if not better.  I'd argue that the research sharing sites are playing with fire.  All it would take would be one not very savvy phisher to post a faux link on a public area of the site and then be able to gain access to critical data.  Banks haven't gone social for a reason: you can't trust the public, or your users.

Pub sharing sites like PubGet, Labmeeting, and Mendeley are interesting although when each has a DMCA link on the front page of their site, you can understand how these sites might eventually disappear as a result of legal problems.  These Napsters for science are already generating a bad taste in many publishers' mouths.

It will be interesting to see how these sites fare during these tough financial times.  I guess sometimes there's a benefit to being a one man show with no overhead ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey David, I just came across your blog during my weekly, &#8220;Who has linked to LabSpaces&#8221; google search.  Looks like you posted this almost a month ago, so I&#8217;m not sure how I missed it, but thanks for the link and the quote.</p>
<p>Pete is 100% right.  Obtaining the initial community is the hardest part and I don&#8217;t think any of the services out there have gotten to that point.  There are three types of science networks out there: The linkedin clones, the research sharers, and the publication sharers.  My site falls somewhere among all three.  </p>
<p>Now, the linkedin clones are useless, so don&#8217;t even try visiting BioMedExperts, academia.edu, scilink, etc.  </p>
<p>The research sharing sites have a decent idea, but as my boss would argue e-mail is just as good, if not better.  I&#8217;d argue that the research sharing sites are playing with fire.  All it would take would be one not very savvy phisher to post a faux link on a public area of the site and then be able to gain access to critical data.  Banks haven&#8217;t gone social for a reason: you can&#8217;t trust the public, or your users.</p>
<p>Pub sharing sites like PubGet, Labmeeting, and Mendeley are interesting although when each has a DMCA link on the front page of their site, you can understand how these sites might eventually disappear as a result of legal problems.  These Napsters for science are already generating a bad taste in many publishers&#8217; mouths.</p>
<p>It will be interesting to see how these sites fare during these tough financial times.  I guess sometimes there&#8217;s a benefit to being a one man show with no overhead <img src='http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: David Crotty</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16686</link>
		<dc:creator>David Crotty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 16:53:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16686</guid>
		<description>Hi Pete, thanks for the comment.  

---I would also think that the creators would have to initially advertise to capture a critical mass.---

Advertising costs money, money requires a business model, and as  far as I've seen, most social networking ventures lack both.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Pete, thanks for the comment.  </p>
<p>&#8212;I would also think that the creators would have to initially advertise to capture a critical mass.&#8212;</p>
<p>Advertising costs money, money requires a business model, and as  far as I&#8217;ve seen, most social networking ventures lack both.</p>
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		<title>By: Pete Shuster</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16685</link>
		<dc:creator>Pete Shuster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 16:49:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16685</guid>
		<description>This is an excellent blog! Thank you.

I have tried tp get discussions going in Niche areas via blogs, i.e, like siRNA transfection efficiency. I know there are some interesting Wiki's out there on methods (see Molecular Station). 

I believe the challenge with sustained social networking is capturing comunities that resonate with one another. When I look at profressional social networking "like attracts like".  I wonder if a bioscience site that could parse to level of "Neuroscience Post Doc doing basic Alzheimer's research would attract a sustainable" community. 

I would also think that the creators would have to intitially advertise to capture a critical mass. There would also have to be enough pertinent info to capture and keep visitors. Facebook had to start somewhere. In the meantime, I'll keep searching...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is an excellent blog! Thank you.</p>
<p>I have tried tp get discussions going in Niche areas via blogs, i.e, like siRNA transfection efficiency. I know there are some interesting Wiki&#8217;s out there on methods (see Molecular Station). </p>
<p>I believe the challenge with sustained social networking is capturing comunities that resonate with one another. When I look at profressional social networking &#8220;like attracts like&#8221;.  I wonder if a bioscience site that could parse to level of &#8220;Neuroscience Post Doc doing basic Alzheimer&#8217;s research would attract a sustainable&#8221; community. </p>
<p>I would also think that the creators would have to intitially advertise to capture a critical mass. There would also have to be enough pertinent info to capture and keep visitors. Facebook had to start somewhere. In the meantime, I&#8217;ll keep searching&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Discussing Web 2.0 &#171; A Man With A Ph.D.</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16678</link>
		<dc:creator>Discussing Web 2.0 &#171; A Man With A Ph.D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 02:27:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16678</guid>
		<description>[...] October 27, 2008 &#8212; Richard    by notsogoodphotography [Crossposted at SpreadingScience] Are scientists missing the boat?;.: [Via Bench Marks] &#8230;.or has that boat already [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] October 27, 2008 &#8212; Richard    by notsogoodphotography [Crossposted at SpreadingScience] Are scientists missing the boat?;.: [Via Bench Marks] &#8230;.or has that boat already [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Discussing Web 2.0</title>
		<link>http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16677</link>
		<dc:creator>Discussing Web 2.0</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 02:24:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cshblogs.org/cshprotocols/2008/10/24/are-scientists-missing-the-boat/#comment-16677</guid>
		<description>[...] notsogoodphotography Are scientists missing the boat?;.: [Via Bench Marks] &#8230;.or has that boat already [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] notsogoodphotography Are scientists missing the boat?;.: [Via Bench Marks] &#8230;.or has that boat already [...]</p>
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